Author Topic: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams  (Read 3991 times)

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Offline hogdownunder

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Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« on: Monday, December 30, 2013. 02:29:40 PM. »
Hi Guys,

Just found this site a few weeks ago. It is a great site!!

My name is Geoff and I'm from Australia..

I am about the change out the SE 255 Cams from my Stock 2008 CVO Softail Springer. I have oil leaks on one head gasket and also a Base seal gasket.. Taking off both cylinders.. This bike is Stock except for V & H Big Radius 2 into 2 exhaust  and it has the 110 engine..

I am going to install the Genesis 577 Cam from GMR or the Kuryakyn TC24D Cam from Kuryakyn..Just curious whether these two cams perform the same?

I know their specs are a little different, does this affect their performance? It would be interesting to see if they perform much the same? Is one better than the other?

Also, can I use the Stock pushrods with the Cam change or do I need to purchase adjustable pushrods. Steve from GMR suggested I could use the the stock pushrod with his Genesis Cam.. What about the Kuryakyn TC24 Cam. Their Website suggests to use adjustable pushrods ( Mike Roland from Kuryakyn maybe can offer some advice ?)..

Any help would be greatly appreciated..

PS: This a great Forum for bike enthusiasts like myself who lack some basic knowledge doing some DIY work on their HD motorbike..

All the best for 2014!!

Best regards,

Aussie..
« Last Edit: Monday, December 30, 2013. 03:07:34 PM. by hogdownunder »

Offline KE5RBD

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #1 on: Monday, December 30, 2013. 09:49:57 PM. »
I would say they are close enough to the same it won't make a difference.  Atleast you won't be able to tell it. Neither one posts the overlap lift and the Kuryakyn TC24D has 1 degree more advance which won't make any noticeable difference.

Online Buffalo

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday, December 31, 2013. 07:23:14 AM. »
Lots of dyno runs here show the two cams gave very similar power levels. Maybe more important is replacing the original lifters with something better. I'd use S&S personally. I'd also be using adjustable pushrods on BOTH cams, to set the lifter 140 in the hole. A .030 head gasket  would also raise com slightly to 10/1. fwiw  Buffalo

Offline Showdog75

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday, December 31, 2013. 07:48:58 AM. »
The 24's base circle is smaller than stock so adjustable pushrods will be necessary.  I asked Mike myself. Can't speak for the 577's,maybe Steve will chime in.

Offline Gmr-Performance

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday, December 31, 2013. 08:03:15 AM. »
You can use stock push rods with our cam.  But really most never due  as why pull the top end when you can swap it out with quick install push rods.

Offline Durwood

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday, December 31, 2013. 08:06:42 AM. »
You can use stock push rods with our cam.  But really most never due  as why pull the top end when you can swap it out with quick install push rods.
With the late model tank it's a breeze, IMO the fact there is no adjustment to mess with and then the cost of the push rods, kind of a no brainer to me.

Offline Gmr-Performance

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #6 on: Tuesday, December 31, 2013. 08:24:35 AM. »
Based on 100+ of our cams  alone that have sold,.... number wise its is 90%+ for quick installs.  I tell them you can use stock but most go the quick install route.  :nix:

Offline Barrett

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #7 on: Tuesday, December 31, 2013. 08:30:43 AM. »
I don't mind opening up the top just to see what's up.. I would rather spend a little more time wrenching at my house then the thought of it biting me on the road.. The stock ones are lighter too  :smile:

Offline Durwood

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #8 on: Tuesday, December 31, 2013. 08:34:07 AM. »
Based on 100+ of our cams  alone that have sold,.... number wise its is 90%+ for quick installs.  I tell them you can use stock but most go the quick install route.  :nix:
I hear ya Steve, I usually use quickies myself, but the last time I had mine apart I went the other direction. Just sharing... Happy New Year :party:

Offline Gmr-Performance

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #9 on: Tuesday, December 31, 2013. 08:40:57 AM. »
All good durwood no issues on this end just reporting what we see on this end.

Offline Durwood

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #10 on: Tuesday, December 31, 2013. 08:43:15 AM. »
All good durwood no issues on this end just reporting what we see on this end.
:up:

Offline hogdownunder

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #11 on: Tuesday, December 31, 2013. 03:16:31 PM. »
Hi Guys,

Thanks for your input.

In my case, it's a case I have to dismantle the top end to replace Head Gaskets and Cylinder Base seals as well. For me, it appears the easy route is to use the GMR 577 Cams as I can use the Stock Pushrods making my build more simple and easier on my pocket.. I am not clued up on how to measure and install adjustable push rods?

If both Cams perform the same, this would make sense to me. I just wasn't sure as the Cams had slightly different specifications and didn't know if they performed differently?

I purchased a  HD SERT when I bought the bike new from HD. I will need to take the bike to a competent SERT user to Dyno tune the bike after I have finished with the install. This to me is is the hard part as I don't know how competent the guys in the HD Workshop are at using that Tuner.  All I seem to hear from them is I should use a HD Performance Cam kit as there is a tune file they can use, with no need for a Dyno Tune?. Sounds to me they are not very competent in using the SERT Tuner. I think I need to find a competent Dyno Shop that can tune the bike with the SERT..

I kind of wish I had a competent Dyno Tuner like Steve from GMR over here in Australia, that would certainly my life easier.. Does anybody know of a competent SERT Dyno Tune Shop here in Australia?

It appears from your advice, I should also install a set of S & S Premium Lifters as well. Do I need to look at anything else while I am at it? This bike has only travelled 1,200 miles  (2,000 klm's) since new..

Steve, what is your opinion on using a .30 Cometic Head Gasket? Because I have already suffered from a leaking Head Gasket from new, does a thinner Head Gasket have a chance of leaking as well, compared to a thicker/newer style HD Head Gasket? Also, does this smaller Head Gasket give a noticeable increase in overall performance for this 110 engine?

I have attached a photo of my 2008 S/E Springer for you. As you can see, I have the fitted a V & H Big Radius exhaust system, everything else is stock..

All the best for 2014..

Best regards,

Aussie..
« Last Edit: Tuesday, December 31, 2013. 08:10:10 PM. by hogdownunder »

Offline KE5RBD

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #12 on: Tuesday, December 31, 2013. 06:55:25 PM. »
The easiest way to deal with that SERT is to contact TTS http://www.mastertune.net/mastertune.htm and do the SERT upgrade.  They have good instructions and good maps.  The SERT is very difficult to find maps unless you already have them.  The upgrade works really well also and has the features of the TTS.  It is a TTS Mastertune HD and you can download all the software and maps from their web site after the upgrade.  You can download anytime.

Online ThumperDeuce

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #13 on: Tuesday, December 31, 2013. 07:00:52 PM. »
If you can't find anyone to tune your SERT, how about putting some o2 bungs in and picking up the PowerVision stuff from DJ and doing it yourself?

http://www.dynojet.com/powervision/
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Offline FSG

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #14 on: Tuesday, December 31, 2013. 07:30:51 PM. »
Quote
Does anybody know of a competent SERT Dyno Tune Shop here in Australia?

Which part of Oz are you in, no point referring you to a tuner in Brissie if your in Tassie.

With only 2000Ks on it the 18538-99B Lifters in it should be in good shape, I'd be tempted to reuse them after roller inspection.  S&S, Woods, Gaterman are all good lifters.  Check out the HTT Vendor Forums.

Base Seal is an O-ring, you sure it's leaking?  If so and you pull the cylinder(s) then before you do check to see where the pistons are at TDC, in or out of the cylinder to see what you may be able to do to improve squish and use the Cometic .030" HGs..

If you've a leaking HG then yes go Cometic .030", done right there wont be a problem.   

Adjustable PR's are not that difficult, there's plenty of " how to " vids on youtube.


Offline hogdownunder

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #15 on: Tuesday, December 31, 2013. 08:06:53 PM. »
Hi Guys,

Thanks for all your advice..


FSG, My bike is NSW..

I am happy to transport the bike to a competant Dyno Tuner Facility to tune the bike after the work is complete.

The rear cylinder is leaking on the Base of the rear left side.  Apparently most of the earlier 110 Motors had this problem (same area) as well as leaking Head Gaskets (front cylinder)?

HD Motor Co had a "Product Campaign" to fix these issues as well as replace the ACR's to the newer updated Model. Owners had 2 years to return their bikes to the HD Dealership to have these problems rectified "Free of charge"..I was never told this by HD Australia, so subsequently, I have to dismantle the engine to fix the leaks myself.
 
Are you in Brisbane? Do you know of any competant Dyno Tuners in NSW or around Brisbane? I have the "Screamin Eagle Pro EFI Super Tuner" fitted to this bike..

Best regards,

Offline FSG

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #16 on: Tuesday, December 31, 2013. 09:52:07 PM. »
I'm in Brissie, contacts in NSW/Sydney these days are limited, give the guys at sandrpro.com in Penrith a bell.

Take a look at the below, to be found in the section

M-1226    2007/2008 CVO 110 C.I. DISPLACEMENT ENGINE UPDATE PRODUCT PROGRAM 0906   28-Jul-08
M-1225    2007/2008 CVO 110 C.I. DISPLACEMENT ENGINE UPDATE PRODUCT PROGRAM 0905   28-Jul-08

Online fidel

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #17 on: Tuesday, December 31, 2013. 11:26:49 PM. »
gaterman lifter +1  cheaper than s&s ask fsg

Online joe_lyons

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #18 on: Wednesday, January 01, 2014. 07:20:56 AM. »
Agree that the stock 99B lifters are good lifters and with so few miles will work just fine.  The 99C lifters on the other hand are chit.
Anybody can jump a motorcycle. The trouble begins when you try to land it. E.K.

Offline rigidthumper

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #19 on: Wednesday, January 01, 2014. 07:53:41 AM. »
Don't forget to change the inner cam bearings to 168s while you're there.

Online strokerjlk

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #20 on: Wednesday, January 01, 2014. 09:01:07 AM. »
you dont mention any goals.
those pipes work really nice with the stock 255's.
a .030 head gasket isn't enough to bring the compression around to either of those cams.
so if your looking for a loss down low and a gain on the big end ? go for it. the bike will feel much softer under normal cruising . this is a common complaint from the 110 stage 2 guys.  gain 10 hp from 4500 rpms up ,lose 10 hp or tq under 4500. all in what your looking for.
chances are a well tuned stage 1 would feel great,since you have never actually harnessed the full potential of what you have.
A scientific theory summarizes a hypothesis
repeated testing establishes theory

Offline hrdtail78

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #21 on: Wednesday, January 01, 2014. 12:40:51 PM. »
http://harleytechtalk.org/htt/index.php/topic,66680.msg715068.html#msg715068

I have also seen the gains of the 24D in a stock 110.  It didn't loose any bottom end.
Semper Fi

Offline hrdtail78

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #22 on: Wednesday, January 01, 2014. 12:48:43 PM. »
2012 Skunk
24D
SE heavy breather
VH power dual
Crusher mellow slip-ons
Semper Fi

Offline bigpete1

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #23 on: Wednesday, January 01, 2014. 01:28:02 PM. »
2012 Skunk
24D
SE heavy breather
VH power dual
Crusher mellow slip-ons

is this one stock 103?thanks pete
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Online strokerjlk

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Re: Installing Genesis 577 or Kuryakyn TC 24 D Cams
« Reply #24 on: Wednesday, January 01, 2014. 01:34:58 PM. »
this is a stage 1 with the same pipes the OP'er has (dyna model)
25 tq at 2400-2500 is quite a loss . depends on what your after.

A scientific theory summarizes a hypothesis
repeated testing establishes theory