Author Topic: EVO vs TWINCAM  (Read 10786 times)

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Offline hbkeith

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EVO vs TWINCAM
« on: Monday, May 14, 2012. 04:02:55 AM. »
Harley Evo vs Twin Cams: The Sweet Years | HD Open Road

Offline hbkeith

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #1 on: Monday, May 14, 2012. 04:03:55 AM. »
Harley Evo vs Twin Cams: The Sweet Years | HD Open Road
  sorry, i guess you have to copy and paste that link        www.hdopenroad.com/guest-articles/harley-evo-vs-twin-cams-the-sweet-years/


Offline Dresser

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #2 on: Monday, May 14, 2012. 04:28:45 AM. »
That's a good article. I agree that the EVO is the better motor. I gave up my '91 Electra Glide for an '04 Road King. It took about two months to realize that while it wasn't a mistake the EVO is the better powerplant.

Offline hd06myway

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #3 on: Monday, May 14, 2012. 05:36:14 AM. »
Loved my Evo, but a better motor?   Not IMO, the TC has more TQ and a broader TQ curve, I just like the way the engine feels, I had to cam my Evo to get it to "pull" like the TC.  Also love the look of the TC, it dwarfs the Evo with it's bigger heads and fins.  I do agree that the Evo is simpler less moving parts so you don't have to worry about cam chains, engine balancers, but I don't worry about them anyway... it's a machine, something breaks you fix it and roll on.   :chop:  I think the Evo was a huge historical step in restoring HDs spot at the top of motorcycling in the USA, and the TC has done nothing to damper that reliablility and has expanded on the Evo and made HD even better, better than they've ever been.

Regarding this statement in the article, the reason you don't see aftermarket TC engines, and no, S&S doesn't make a TC designed engine, they came out with the Wedge motor (ugly BTW), that ain't no TC... is because HD is still holding the patent, they don't want every aftermarket co. building reverse eng'd HD motors like the Evo. S&S and others make big bore kits for TCs, they do not make TC style comeplete motors, not unless they want to be in court with HD...

"Although the Twin Cam engine is indeed a serious contender; by comparison the single cam, cone motor (Evo/Shovelhead) is undeniably not an inferior design. A great testament to this statement is the fact that not many of the aftermarket engine manufactures even build a Twin Cam. Almost all simply stick with the proven single cam design. And even though S&S does make a Twin Cam, you never see it and I think it’s great testimony that even after all these years almost every custom or chopper out there still uses a single cam engine; weather it be an 80 inch Evo (you can still buy a brand new Evolution crate motor), 100 inch Rev Tec, a 117 inch S&S, 140 inch Ultima, 152 inch Ilmor, or some other."

« Last Edit: Monday, May 14, 2012. 05:47:19 AM. by hd06myway »

Offline Deye76

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #4 on: Monday, May 14, 2012. 05:51:05 AM. »
The TC's have undergone a few gear changes so they may indeed feel to have a "broader tq curve", but stock power output is prolly on a equal level per cu. in.  I have to agree about the Evo being more reliable. Cranks and cam tensioners alone make the TC's more money to deal with. Increasing the power on both has issues, the Evo being the weak cases, and the TC already mentioned. My low compression 100" S&S Evo style crate motor was by far the smoothest most reliable engine I've ever owned, and made 100hp/105tq out of the wood box, and didn't need comp. releases. As for one being better than the other, better is going to be different for each of us.  IME it's a toss up. 

Had a few beers with the guy that owns the blue dresser in Milwaukee at the 105th. He used to freelance for Easyrider years ago.
« Last Edit: Monday, May 14, 2012. 05:53:19 AM. by Deye76 »
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Offline smittyon66

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #5 on: Monday, May 14, 2012. 07:35:57 AM. »
To each their own, run whatever you like. I like evos more but I can understand why people like twincams.
Forget the bullsh!t - it's all about two wheels and a motor!

Offline Tsani

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #6 on: Monday, May 14, 2012. 07:51:54 AM. »
Panheads rule!
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Offline 05FLHTC

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #7 on: Monday, May 14, 2012. 07:55:45 AM. »
Indiviual choice is what the USA is all about X2.

But let's get real the TC will never be any more then a pimple riding on the EVO's arse  :missed:
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Offline CraigArizona85248

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #8 on: Monday, May 14, 2012. 08:03:34 AM. »

Offline Bruno-Katz Fokkerpilot

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #9 on: Monday, May 14, 2012. 08:55:20 AM. »
Thanks for posting that Keith, what a brilliant article that is and, i agree with every word he says.  :rtfb:
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Offline krimp

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #10 on: Monday, May 14, 2012. 06:50:18 PM. »
hd06myway-   Regarding this statement in the article, the reason you don't see aftermarket TC engines, and no, S&S doesn't make a TC designed engine, they came out with the Wedge motor (ugly BTW), that ain't no TC... is because HD is still holding the patent, they don't want every aftermarket co. building reverse eng'd HD motors like the Evo. S&S and others make big bore kits for TCs, they do not make TC style comeplete motors, not unless they want to be in court with HD...
What is this?????
http://www.sscycle.com/feature/featureview.php?s_id=13
« Last Edit: Monday, May 14, 2012. 06:54:16 PM. by krimp »

Offline Rokinrider

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #11 on: Monday, May 14, 2012. 08:04:21 PM. »
 Thanksd Krimp!!! I was just about to post the same link!!! S&S also makes a 111" square motor that is Carb'd and looks to be a good "pricey" choice for a bagger. I'd rather get a motor from the hard working people at Viola Wisc. than support the Moco!! It's a great place to ride as well awesome roads in my nieghbor state of Wisconsin!!! :gob: :gob:
Mclintock! swell party were the wiskey

Offline Tsani

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #12 on: Monday, May 14, 2012. 08:48:24 PM. »
And you think there are no hard working people at the MoCo?
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Offline chopper

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #13 on: Tuesday, May 15, 2012. 04:50:56 AM. »
It all gets tedious after a while.............

 Every time HD brings out a new generation of engines, we go through this same old crap! And fondly remember the "good old days (and engine)" Does anyone else remember the hate that followed the intro of the now revered EVO?  Horrendous base gasket leaks, flimsy aluminum cylinders, studs that pulled out of cases, way down on power, and  of course, "Don't SOUND like a "real" Harley!

  Wait a little longer.  The cycle will repeat yet again. HD will introduce the next generation of engine, and we'll hear it all again.
 And believe it or not, folks will reminisce  about the good old days off the TC. Powerful, easily bored and stroked, reliable, oil tight, and of course, a HUGE aftermarket  support!

  Why... the new engine? well it overly complicated, expensive, no parts support aftermarket, and dealer only maintained..

And so it starts all over.....
"Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts" – Richard Feynman

Offline hd06myway

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #14 on: Tuesday, May 15, 2012. 07:24:07 AM. »
hd06myway-   Regarding this statement in the article, the reason you don't see aftermarket TC engines, and no, S&S doesn't make a TC designed engine, they came out with the Wedge motor (ugly BTW), that ain't no TC... is because HD is still holding the patent, they don't want every aftermarket co. building reverse eng'd HD motors like the Evo. S&S and others make big bore kits for TCs, they do not make TC style comeplete motors, not unless they want to be in court with HD...
What is this?????
http://www.sscycle.com/feature/featureview.php?s_id=13



Your link...It's not a Twin Cam motor... it's an Evo replica... it just bolts with other mods to a TC frame, it also doesn't have engine counter balancers, so as a Softail rider, I have zero interest, besides, you can clearly see by the Evo style heads (much smaller than the beefy TC), this isn't a twin cam, it's a single cam bolt in (with mods),   you won't find any one but HD making complete TWIN CAM motors.  They still hold the patent.
« Last Edit: Tuesday, May 15, 2012. 07:29:57 AM. by hd06myway »

Offline chopper

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #15 on: Tuesday, May 15, 2012. 09:52:40 AM. »
Not that I got a dog in this fight, but that sure IS a twin cam engine! It takes the EXACT same cams that S&S sells for 99 to 06 TC's.

And don't patents expire after 14 years? TC's hit the market in 99 so HD must have had the patent prior to that. That puts the patent at 14 years old.
"Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts" – Richard Feynman

Offline hd06myway

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #16 on: Tuesday, May 15, 2012. 10:07:52 AM. »
Not that I got a dog in this fight, but that sure IS a twin cam engine! It takes the EXACT same cams that S&S sells for 99 to 06 TC's.

And don't patents expire after 14 years? TC's hit the market in 99 so HD must have had the patent prior to that. That puts the patent at 14 years old.

Chopper/Krimp, I stand corrected, it does say gear driven cams, patent must have run out, it looks different than the HD TC, but S&S site does say high lift gear driven cams...

Offline chopper

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #17 on: Tuesday, May 15, 2012. 11:00:08 AM. »
Yeah, I think I'm partly wrong too, The pushrod geometry isn't quite the same as an HD TC either.. :embarrassed:
"Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts" – Richard Feynman

Online dakota224

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #18 on: Tuesday, May 15, 2012. 01:32:01 PM. »
I remember when the Twin cams first cam out,  headin for sturgis on I-90 you could tell who was on a twin cam versus the Evo. Twin cam bikes were cruisin along @ 80+ mph  ,  the Evo guys around 70+ ..  for hundreds of miles.

Offline fourthgear

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #19 on: Tuesday, May 15, 2012. 02:31:42 PM. »

Offline CaptMike

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #20 on: Tuesday, May 15, 2012. 02:59:49 PM. »
I remember when the Twin cams first cam out,  headin for sturgis on I-90 you could tell who was on a twin cam versus the Evo. Twin cam bikes were cruisin along @ 80+ mph  ,  the Evo guys around 70+ ..  for hundreds of miles.

Now that's some funny Shit, I don't care who you are or what you ride.   I've blown by a few old Pan's on my Evo is that the same?  :bike:
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Offline Tsani

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #21 on: Tuesday, May 15, 2012. 03:41:09 PM. »
I remember when the Twin cams first cam out,  headin for sturgis on I-90 you could tell who was on a twin cam versus the Evo. Twin cam bikes were cruisin along @ 80+ mph  ,  the Evo guys around 70+ ..  for hundreds of miles.

Now that's some funny Shit, I don't care who you are or what you ride.   I've blown by a few old Pan's on my Evo is that the same?  :bike:

Like I said.... :bike:
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Offline hbkeith

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #22 on: Wednesday, May 16, 2012. 03:53:32 AM. »
It all gets tedious after a while.............

 Every time HD brings out a new generation of engines, we go through this same old crap! And fondly remember the "good old days (and engine)" Does anyone else remember the hate that followed the intro of the now revered EVO?  Horrendous base gasket leaks, flimsy aluminum cylinders, studs that pulled out of cases, way down on power, and  of course, "Don't SOUND like a "real" Harley!

  Wait a little longer.  The cycle will repeat yet again. HD will introduce the next generation of engine, and we'll hear it all again.
 And believe it or not, folks will reminisce  about the good old days off the TC. Powerful, easily bored and stroked, reliable, oil tight, and of course, a HUGE aftermarket  support!

  Why... the new engine? well it overly complicated, expensive, no parts support aftermarket, and dealer only maintained..

And so it starts all over.....                                                                                                                  I dont call a engine thats been out since 99 a new design  :nix:

Offline sandrooney

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #23 on: Wednesday, May 16, 2012. 05:03:03 AM. »
From flatheads to twincams, from Nortons to BSA, from Honda to Yamaha, there all fun. If its a motorcycle lets ride it.

SR
Patience is such a waste of time .

Offline chopper

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Re: EVO vs TWINCAM
« Reply #24 on: Wednesday, May 16, 2012. 07:05:07 AM. »
call a engine thats been out since 99 a new design

Nope. you missed the idea.  I was saying thats what people will say when the NEXT new engine comes along. People will look back and revere the TC (much as they do the EVO now)
"Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts" – Richard Feynman